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2 stroke stinger length. A reduction of about 26% in area.
2 stroke stinger length. 86 250r - original, almost stock. (Same as 3 cyl ski chamber) It seems the chamber size stays relatively the same whether doing 1, 2 or 3 cylinders. How do you know so much about 2 stroke expansion chambers? About 13 years ago I got deeply involved in 2 stroke technology by studying and experimenting in order to improve my 55cc motorized bicycle. Length: 10–15x the stinger diameter Diameter: D_s = 0. Example: A 125cc four-stroke engine combusts about 110cc of F/A gasses but a 125cc two-stroke engine combusts about 180cc of F/A gasses. see pic. 453 mm (57. However, the two-stroke cycle can be difficult for some to visualize at first because certain phases of the cycle occur The article also provides simple instructions for modifying a standard 2-stroke exhaust by cutting off a portion of the stinger. 1969 Suzuki TR 500 Weight: 135 kg Engine: Air-cooled 500 Oct 28, 2014 · Often doo uses the same pipe body but uses a different diameter and length of stinger size for each engine size. Sep 3, 2006 · So the length, diameter, shape, and baffles of the pipe are hgely important, but the stinger will have VERY little effect IF ANY (which I doubt) on the performance. 4), GPM= (cc intake volume x 1. However, the two-stroke cycle can be difficult for some to visualize at first because certain phases of the cycle occur simultaneously, causing it to be hard Similar threads Thoughts of using 2 part putty as a way to decrease stinger tip diameter on f2 exhaust CuriousJojo100 Apr 1, 2024 Performance Mods 2 Replies 15 Views 2K Jun 1, 2024 NeedSpeed Carb clearance, intake length and muffler MinimumVK Mar 8, 2024 2-Stroke Engines 2 Replies 17 Views 2K Mar 17, 2024 robe R Y Oct 28, 2014 · Often doo uses the same pipe body but uses a different diameter and length of stinger size for each engine size. The stinger length (not to be confused with the diameter) is really only relevant for tuning above 9000 RPM. exhaust: 1inch ID, and long. If the pipe tuning is coming on where your porting is giving up, as you did state, it will make more difference than reducing your stinger. 00027 conversion factor cc to gallons x RPM), length of stinger in feet (mm/305), . Stingers length is important, too, because it's part of the total pipe length and volume. this is an old pic of the exhaust pipe. 5 thermal expansion x . Feb 10, 2003 · The tailsection of a two-stroke (stinger/muffler) works as a pressure bleed. Mar 1, 2012 · Since there are different formulas available for stinger size and length I recommend a pipe builder experiment with different sizes to best fit the engine and the application. Two Stroke Expansion Chamber Design Professor Blair's tests proved that the return waves timing can be calculated fairly closely using the straight distances and the pressure wave speed in the pipe for that distance. You can have internal stingers like I'm having to do on the RG500 pipes I'm doing now. 4mm (1 inch) ID so it can be Apr 2, 2010 · Tom is correct, stinger diameter has a more profound function than the length ,in that chassis i doubt you can alter the length enough to have an effect. Blair's formula also included the two angle diverging cone. Mind you it's out of the January 1997 issue of DIRT BIKE, but it's the basics on 2 stroke pipes. So I put formulas based on that in an Excel workbook file to analyze an Sep 15, 2022 · A Bpipe outlet diameter is 2" od, 1. He recommends not going over a combined baffle angle of 30 degrees (15 from centerline) although many successful pipes use much larger angles. If you prefer to have a graphical representation of tuning fundamentals then click With the Stinger Motorized Bike + BBR Tuning 2-Stroke Engine DIY kit you will be cruising in style with no effort. 3 exhaust jolly p77r carb vhsh30 Edd Santos and 19 others 20 19 Paul Hail Decreasing the id of the Smokercraft Boats 151 Stinger and Yamaha outboard engines four stroke or two stroke at J& P Marine 2-Stroke Silencer, NH-004-01A,Product Description 2-Stroke Silencer NEW SHORTER END CAP! The same silencer we use on our HVCcycle Performance Exhaust 62mm (2 7/16) round. I plan on doing the same with my 99 but just wanted to know if anyone else has done this. 9 in) Overall Height: 1 125 mm (44. RCGF Stinger 10cc RE Glow size：economy and powerful NEW ENGINE ,NEW Design,More powerful,Stronger material , More precision , More shining Latest Design & Strong Power ！ The NEW Stinger 10cc RE is the latest design engine. 001 specific gravity, . engine: 48cc, 2 Stroke. Was wondering if anyone did the math for stinger length. This is why exhaust gas sampling on two stroke engines is done with a special valve right in the exhaust port. Yeah I didn't think 150mm looked super large, I still have to try other software and fix up some numbers, maybe it will get closer to 2. com -- A 2 stroke motorcycle reference guide Jun 16, 2009 · Re: Internal stingers by hybrid » Thu Jan 10, 2013 11:47 am Most of what I have read says absolutely no change in performance. Mar 26, 2020 · From this information he determines the segment lengths and the header length. Nov 28, 2004 · Dennis400 103 posts · Joined 2004 #19 · Dec 6, 2004 Originally posted by madcow [br] with the math that gave you the pipe length, what diameter do you use, what size tail peice, what thickness of material, how big of diameter stinger outside and inside diameter, what length stinger. 62 times the header diameter, and its length should be 2. The important things are firstly (and most importantly) the length from piston face to start of stinger and secondly header length, cone lengths, belly length, and then header diameter, belly diameter and stinger diameter. 3 in) Wheelbase: 1. Dr. Feb 8, 2019 · Alright, so i have a few SBP expansion chambers laying around. So the length, diameter, shape, and baffles of the pipe are hgely important, but the stinger will have VERY little effect IF ANY (which I doubt) on the performance. 34 cP viscosity for exhaust, results in a calculation of psi difference from beginning to The stinger is basically a bleed valve/orifice that controls the volume of the exiting gas. i doubt you will notice a mere 5 inches, but at the extreme of this idea, if you had a pipe with a 2" long stinger it would probably perform worse. Find out all of the information about the RANS product: single-seat ULM S-18 STINGER II. 172 mm (85. Sep 3, 2013 · So, a pipe on a 2 stroke, how it is shaped & the length of it, is real important so far as performance, not just something to get the smoke out of the engine. Very light only 1lb 6oz (with flange) Mounting flange is Steel with a 25. However, the two-stroke cycle can be difficult for some to visualize at first because certain phases of the cycle occur 1969 Suzuki T 500 II Titan Overall Length: 2. With the Shorty you’re looking at a stainless stinger, stainless end cap, and a lightweight aluminum canister body that’s cut short to give you both more low end punch, and less of a chance of crunching the As you can see in Pictures 6 & 7, I don't have the "header" or "stinger"- I used the stock head pipe cut to the length given in the design since it was the right diameter, and the "stinger" or last part of the pipe was so small in diameter I found a piece of pipe that was right and just cut it to length. Started by Dvsrd, April 17, 2019, 06:32:39 AM Previous topic - Next topic 0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. Why not run a long, large diameter stinger? The pipe has tofit on the bike!!! How Two-Stroke Expansion Chambers Work, As for length of stinger it's not so critical as the ID, I've run longer stingers but upped the ID to suit. As for length of stinger it's not so critical as the ID, I've run longer stingers but upped the ID to suit. 47 hp @ 7 000 rpm, 5. 2021 Lowe Stinger 175C Boat reviews, 2021 Lowe Stinger 175C Boat prices, 2021 Lowe Stinger 175C Boat specs, Lowe Boat pictures, 2021 Lowe Stinger 175C Boat, Boats. Jul 11, 2020 · 2 stroke comeback. I don't need a muffler on my 2 stroke, I would just have to re-jet it. Now, i am going to braze onto the expansion chamber a 5/8 wide tube. This is a bit difficult to measure considering this is Feb 11, 2014 · I have recently doubled the size of the expansion chamber and moved the stinger pipe to half way point of the ex chamber. He calculates the stinger length as a multiple of its diameter whereas in reality the same back pressure can be had by a fat long stinger as by a skinny short stinger. I keep thinking that i should have made it a bit longer? Aug 2, 2006 · The ideal stinger diameter should be . Stinger length is one of the least important aspects of the two stroke exhaust. 2-strokes need backpressure to work properly or get max performance the real question should be. As well as determining the degree of taper to use on a tap Jul 12, 2018 · On a two-stroke engine, an expansion chamber or tuned pipe is a tuned exhaust system used to enhance its power output by improving its volumetric efficiency. Yeah the stinger (tail pipe) is too small but that's the first thing to get chopped back. He also proved that the return waves are generated all along the length of the diffuser and baffle cones. I have a shorty but I am still curious what the longer silencer would do. Although I focus on tuning bicycle motors, the same principles can be used to great effect with any 2-stroke engine. I suspect you might do well to make your tertiary length the same as the primary+secondary length, or maybe a multiple of that, like 2x May 8, 2020 · Don’t let your 2 stroke hold you back power-wise… Not when you can implement a couple of simple hacks to give it that long-overdue performance edge when out there. The stock pipe is basically a straight pipe anyway but I want to pit a straight pipe on it with a new school silencer on it. In addition to head pipe length, divergent and convergent cone lengths, an expansion chamber has three more crucial dimensions. This DIY kit comes with everything you need to make a motorized bicycle and the simplicity of its assembly will have you ready in no time. Stroke is factored into the displacement of the engine. Nov 5, 2009 · Yeah I totally blew that!! I meant the OPPOSITE!! Been a while since I tuned or owned a 2 stroke!! You do want to LENGTHEN the headpipe. I will find out when I go for a ride. The stroke does have an effect on pipe building, if I remeber correctly it is in the diffuser cone angle. The area of the stinger is usually around 60% of that of the header so the exhaust pulse is compressed 2 Stroke Engine Running Animation DiagramsAs the 2 stroke engine animation below shows, a two-stroke engine in its purest form is extremely simple in construction and operation, as it only has three primary moving parts (the piston, connecting rod, and crankshaft). Everything you need to know about tuning your motorized bicycle. 5 in) Overall Width: 835 mm (32. If the geometry of the exhaust is not quite right, your engine could potentially lose power. That expansion causes a strong return suction wave that can change the second half of the baffles return wave negatively. --- 🧱 Step 4: Mockup & Layout Once you have the dimensions, you can build your template: 1. 97-inch stroke), and that represents a mean piston speed of 4500 rpm. A simple and effective guide to fast motorized bikes. Jan 25, 2012 · the silencer acts as part of the stinger section, the stinger section acts as a bleed-off for backpressure. Mar 27, 2025 · 2 Stroke - Stinger Return Wave- Without a silencer the pressure pulse traveling thru the stinger suddenly expands when it leaves the stinger. As it came loose and rotated on the bottom bolt I would say that it blocked part of the stingers full diameter. On our big bore RS motors we used the SPI pipe body with modifications to the primary runner and had good results,stinger remained the same. Oct 24, 2009 · I read about an internal stinger pipe in the 2 stroke handbook. More related to piston stroke It would seem the stinger size has some effect and length looking at some 2 stroke books but apparently length you need another 150 mm to notice it Most lamby seem to be around the 23- 25 mm got a aprilla RS 120 can can which seems to be 23 mm and longer may try that and one which is in about 28 off somthing The 1967 T125 was a totally different bike from the T125 Stinger, introduced in 1969. As far as I know, the model was only available in Japan. If you are porting the cylinders to the RS specs then Apr 3, 2012 · Well I wanna know if anyone has been running a stinger on modern yzs. Started cutting up the MZ65 to make it fit and found the stock stinger only goes into the chamber about 1/2". 86 to 3 times its own diameter. I've copied it word for word, so don't blame me for any odd, funny or generally weird remarks! BTWfor those of you asking about mufflers and diameters, check out the last Jun 15, 2025 · 2 STROKE WORLD 2 STROKE WORLD . Mar 10, 2008 · To answer your question about cc vs stroke length determining stinger size, the two are the same. Stinger comes out the side of the belly on some pipes. speeds due to insufficient back pressure. The rear exhaust design make it fit more narrow airplanes especially the warbirds . And I Aug 16, 2006 · What will a two stroke run like without an expansion chamber? I'm building a little street legal 30s style hillclimber out of a 73 DT1(250). With the MT50 exhaust, the expansion chamber at the front is the important part, and the silencer at the back is essentially just there to muffle it while adding some stinger length. Body is 260mm (10. but the header length is still the same. kenny wrote: First off you are a tad confused. It also includes specifications for constructing a perfect power pipe for a bicycle motor. Stinger diameter affects the top and bottom end. 25 inches) long, Small stinger is 45mm long All aluminum construction except for the mounting flange. A nozzle or restricter at the stinger entry also has the effect of making the stinger length basically a non issue. 00 EZ-GO golf cart - Rotax503 engine. an equal addition to the stinger length? As in do I shorten the existing stinger by an An example that comes to mind is the Bultaco 125cc TSS, which had a stroke of no less 2. how much pipe before and after the chamber? Feb 20, 2009 · Exhaust Pipe "Theory" With all the questions about expansion chambers going on, I thought that I would pass this on again. Here is a thread that speaks to some of the stinger sizing Jan 19, 2025 · The internal stinger makes perfect sense for a two stroke, but for a four cylinder four stroke everything is different. This would have increased the back pressure increasing the heat within the pipe which in turn entered the engine causing RCGF - Stinger RC Aircraft Engines Built with strength and power in mind RCGF’s Stinger two-stroke petrol range covers every popular size from a 10cc single, through 26 and 35 right up to a range-topping 125cc twin. Jul 22, 2014 · Here is a bit of info on pipe building I've gathered over the years,, A Graham Bell has a great book on two stroke tuning that has a wonderful chapter on pipe building. Feb 7, 2020 · 7. The stinger is the tube that the siencer/muffler/can attatches to. Note that modifications we cover are helpful for anything with a 2 stroke engine – chainsaws, weed eaters, ocean-going Jan 30, 2019 · The important things are firstly (and most importantly) the length from piston face to start of stinger and secondly header length, cone lengths, belly length, and then header diameter, belly diameter and stinger diameter. The gas exiting the stinger has had too much resident time and mixing with gas from other cycles causing errors in analysis. An expansion chamber exhausts is designed to produce more torque (acceleration) and extra power (top speed). any suggestions? speeds due to insufficient back pressure. Apr 23, 1996 · A complete two-stroke pipe has properly tuned header, convergent, belly, divergent and stinger sections--a difficult process. Why not run a long, large diameter stinger? The pipe has tofit on the bike!!! How Two-Stroke Expansion Chambers Work, A somewhat shorter center section than the program predicted worked best, and an internal stinger, where the stinger extends into the pipe for the full baffle cone length works slightly better than the same stinger reversed in the conventional position. I think it is like everything else, people have different theories on pipe building. I detail best practice, and the most cost effective approach, to tuning 2-stroke bicycle engines. The length of the straight 'belly' between the divergent and the convergent cones, the length of the tailpiece 'stinger', or muffler, and the diameter of the belly section. I can find a lot of info on stinger diameter and length, but not on using two different lengths together We can use these input parameters: diameter stinger interior in inches (which is millimeters/25. mainly stinger lengths and endcan exit id and what it affects i have 2 one short and one long and 2 endcans one 22mm id and ones 17mm dose the length of the stinger change anything same as the endcan exit engine is mhr77 50x39. You are talking about the can not the stinger. Effective area needs to be closer to 35/40mm but with water getting squirted into the stinger it decreases effective area so about 45/50mm dia. But after saying all that it's best to run the correct size and length stinger that the pipe was designed to run. 3 in) Dry weight: 187 kg (411 lbs) Engine: Air-cooled 492cc 2-stroke aluminum twin. Does trimming them negatively affect performance? 7. 2-stroke Geometrical diagram First off, the size/length of the header, stinger, and belly is directly proportional to the size of the engine. Details The R-304 Shorty Silencer is Pro Circuit’s go-to option for riders that want maximum power, the best sound, and a compact size for their track-oriented 2 stroke dirt bikes. I am asuming longer equals lower rpm and shorter equals higher rev's? Kia Motors Media Journalist Information NewsSelect up to 3 trims to compare with: 2T Exhaust Calc - Ver 1. Today, most pipe builders neglect that very important feature. 2 Stroke Engine Running Animation DiagramsAs the 2 stroke engine animation below shows, a two-stroke engine in its purest form is extremely simple in construction and operation, as it only has three primary moving parts (the piston, connecting rod, and crankshaft). 58 to . If you dig around on the web I call it the "belly stinger". I had a 98 and the baffle burned out so I replaced it with straight steel and wow it was worth all the racket. Strong Power give you unprecedented fly experience. Nov 6, 2009 · i think the diameter is affected by how long the stinger is for the application to achieve the desired back pressure. Schuster) A two-stroke in its purest form is extremely simple in construction and operation, as it only has three primary moving parts (the piston, connecting rod, and crankshaft). 36-inches (decidedly long for a 125) but which would, in factory road racing trim run up to 11,500 rpm, just like the Yamaha TD-2 (with a much shorter, 1. Below we show you how to make a 2 stroke more powerful and make your racing beast the talk of the town. 5" long, compared to the 1/2" wide, 2 1/4" long stinger tube that originally came attatched to the SBP chamber. Not only is it enjoyable to build a motorized bicycle, but 2-stroke engines are great fun to tune. As the forces in a two-stroke pipe design have become more well-understood, designers have been able to create engines that take more advantage of them and in fact require an expansion chamber to run at all. I cut out the 1/2" wide by 2 1/4" long stinger that was on the expansion chamber when i took the silencer can off. Contact a supplier or the parent company directly to get a quote or to find out a price or your closest point of sale. . Generally, longer stingers help low and midrange power. 1. Replies45 Created15 yr Last Reply 15 yr 3 4 18 11 Nov 12 Nov 8 Nov 11 Nov 7 The Spanky 3 posts Smacaroni 4 posts Feb 22, 2013 · A 2 stroke would run better if there was something doing more to get all of the exhaust out of the cylinder and into the expansion chamber. 0 / 6th April 2019 2T Exhaust Calc is a Freeware program created to design a 2 Stroke engine performance exhaust system generally referred to as an "Expansion Chamber" The software equations used are derived from the work of Professor Gordon P Blair who carried out the most comprehensive scientic study of 2 stroke engines ever undertaken and published by SAE (Society Oct 24, 2008 · The stinger length on those pipes is very unequal, because it includes whatever is inside of the silencers. Dec 25, 2009 · Does anyone know the relationship between pipe length and rpm. net The 2-Stroke Garage Turning Wrenches Stinger lengths Sep 3, 2013 · So, a pipe on a 2 stroke, how it is shaped & the length of it, is real important so far as performance, not just something to get the smoke out of the engine. A smaller ID pipe will hold heat in the pipe giving you more peak power (shorter pipe) with the risk of melting pistons if to small. 2 kg-m @ 6 000 rpm Here's more Suzuki T500 info. Of the few books and papers on expansion pipe design, they all recommend a stinger diameter of 60-70% of the headpipe diameter. The actual gas leaving the pipe during a particular cycle was created two or three cycles earlier. Here is a thread that speaks to some of the stinger sizing May 8, 2020 · Don’t let your 2 stroke hold you back power-wise… Not when you can implement a couple of simple hacks to give it that long-overdue performance edge when out there. 8. since 2-stroke pipes are WAY harder to make then a 4-stroke pipe, why does a 4-stroke exhaust system cost close to $700 on average when a 2-stroke is about $300? Because like lemmings we fork over that much cash for them. Feb 8, 2019 · Hey mate, what xpansion chamber do ya run and what is the diameter and length of the stinger on yours? Mine is now 5/8" wide and a bit over 3. Stinger engines come complete with a time-honoured Walbro carburettor, beautifully crisp castings, high-quality bearings and a bulletproof crank system, these are engines that . Although the length, and width, of the expansion chamber is fundamental to performance, changing the length of the header pipe (moving the chamber up or down on the engine pipe) can change the RPM at which the engines develops peak power. 3cyl. So much more power. The length of the silencer core does in effect add more than its actual measured length to the stinger. 58 \times D_b Where = belly pipe diameter For example, if your belly is 38mm, your stinger should be ~22mm. My friend is a dumbass and his truck is slower than it was before if it changed it at all. Its shape has to pull the exhaust out of the engine & then force some of it back in, for the engine to perform proper. Note that modifications we cover are helpful for anything with a 2 stroke engine – chainsaws, weed eaters, ocean-going It would seem the stinger size has some effect and length looking at some 2 stroke books but apparently length you need another 150 mm to notice it Most lamby seem to be around the 23- 25 mm got a aprilla RS 120 can can which seems to be 23 mm and longer may try that and one which is in about 28 off somthing Aug 5, 2009 · 20% WoW and what method was used to get this figure? seeing the baffles on two strokes actually ad to performnce and all Playing with expantion chamber size baffle/stinger length is where the HP comes from in two strokes not remvoing them Last edited: Aug 10, 2009 B 2-strokes need backpressure to work properly or get max performance the real question should be. Expansion chambers were invented and successfully manufactured by Limbach, a German engineer, in 1938, to economize fuel in two stroke engines. How we arrive at the diameters of the Belly section or Neutral chamber and the Outlet Stinger pipe. 2 stroke exhaust length effects on power Ive heard varying things on how silencer length affects power on 2 strokes. This is the unique super-charging effect of two-stroke engines. Surprisingly, the header length and the stinger length were both substantially shorter than the pipes of the day. Powerfactor pipe is 1. May 6, 2022 · In this article, we showcase all the Best 2 stroke silencers that are available for your dirt bike! May 31, 2004 · A complete two-stroke pipe has properly tuned header, convergent, belly, divergent and stinger sections--a difficult process. Im not exactly smart enough to understand the theory of why it would work one way or another. Stinger is just a pressure bleed in any pipe, even if its straight out the back. It's everything after the last cone including the diameter and length ('volume') of any and all pipes afterward. The stinger length officially ends at the beganning of the perforated core of the baffle and starts and the end of the convergent cone of the expansion chamber. It has the effect like you were after basically keeping more heat and pressure in the pipe to pump up the power curve but its more forgiving. 5x header diameter, but I would rather go off the dimensions that are calculated rather than guess. The 1/5 scale boats are using the design and also the 1/5th scale baja weed wacker motors Oct 6, 2023 · Much larger belly diameters are common now as is bigger stingers and stinger length considerations. The main advantage of two-stroke engines is that they can combust more volume of fuel/air mixture than the swept volume of the engine. Ive heard some say that using a shorty increases low end power and also that it increases top end power. And as the picture above shows, you can "hide" the stinger to shorten the overall pipe length. A reduction of about 26% in area. Oct 24, 2008 · The stinger length on those pipes is very unequal, because it includes whatever is inside of the silencers. Parameter Apr 12, 2016 · The stinger restricts flow out of the chamber to cause higher pressure during the compression cycle and empties the chamber during the compression/power stroke to ready it for the next cycle. 2 in) Ground Clearance 160 mm (6. All the action has allready happend in the diffuser and baffle sections but without the correct length stinger to bleed off the pressure you will overheat, seize your engine, make very little power ect. You can also just weld shut the stinger and drill a hole in the belly and weld a stinger pipe there. 625" id. Two Stroke Engine Work Explanation (written by Joseph A. Removing the silencer will change the pressure bleed and keep heat from building in the pipe, making it act as if the tuned length of the pipe was incredibly LONG. Jun 19, 2014 · Anyone running a powercore 2 or have run the shorty and power core2? I am curious because fmf tells me the hot setup for the sst pipe is the longer powercore silencer. Unlike the Stinger that was styled like a competition bike, the original T125 looked more like the other bikes of the Suzuki T series, the T20 being the most famous of them. 1 day ago · Modifying Higgspeed chambers, location of internal stinger. Is there a length to go by or am i ok with my May 2, 2004 · Nitro On-Road - Stinger length and performance? - Does length of a pipe's stinger affect its performance? If so, how? Some pipes come with long stingers that are more easily susceptible to bending upon impact. The stingers length and inside diameter are selected to match the engines requirements. Jul 14, 2012 · If you have ever listened to an expansion chamber unsilenced you would swear that they were designed to increase the exhaust noise as much as possible, and you wouldn't be far from the truth. Apr 28, 2019 · Can somebody explain how the stinger lengths work in GP pipes (both silencers on same side) The outer pipe has a much shorter stinger than the inside pipe. Silencer length in relation to an existing stinger length: If you add a silencer to a chamber does it become. Many exhausts on the market are pocket-rocket exhausts that have been modified to fit on a motorized bike. The silencer is a muffler that attaches to the stinger pipe via donut grommet that seals the two together with tension provided by springs. 825" id. Just like 2 stroke dirtbike engines/pipes. lwapbwldgohtonqrdrykbvxpihdombgcgfndejntqtabaxllrishkxjhepjfoe